Hello All, newbie here to the forum with an issue with my (new to me) 2013 Dodge Durango Citadel AWD 5.7 with 64,000 miles. I say the issue is from day 2 on because the car was obviously warmed up when I first looked at it and also on the day I picked it up. It was only until the morning after that I noticed the issue.

I purchased it from a private dealership here in NY about a month ago. NYS lemon law is 60 days warranty in this case. Since then Ive been having an issue with a cold start. Its kind of hard to describe. Basically, when cold (or sitting a few hours), you push the start button and the engine turns over however once it begins to fire, it stumbles/shakes upon doing so and maybe you would even here a Knock or two during the stumbling start (running engine does not knock). It always starts but might be slightly delayed by a second or two. Once started, it seems to run fine. Warm starts are a lot better but you can still detect the slightest stumble at start. I took it back to the dealer twice and they said that all 5.7 Hemi motors do this very same thing and its normal and not to worry. Im no fool, (shade tree DIYer for over 20 years) and realize that this is not normal behavior for any vehicle. Although I must say, without a check engine light or a 'no start' issue, this would give them every reason to weasel their way out of it. I asked them for documentation of the warranty inquiry visit however they wont provide anything. So with that being said, it looks like im probably on my own with this one and hope that its nothing major. Since then, ive been changing parts blindly (which I know from experience is one of the worst things to do) although, I have nothing to go on and some of what im doing is maintenance related anyway.

What Ive done so far:
Direct replacement NGK spark plugs
Ignition coils
Oil change
Obd2 scan (no codes)
Computer reset
air filter
Cam sensor
Removed and cleaned the throttle body
New battery

I suppose some of the things on my 'to do list' should be:
A fuel pressure test
possibly a crank sensor
possibly a compression test

Has anyone experienced a similar issue or have any suggestions?
Thanks in advance

I posted a video on a cold start up. Needless to say its very hard to hear even with your volume turned way up.

View attachment 99238

Fuel pump probably. Had mine replaced on my hemi. My start up was similar to yours with the delay. Not as long or bad as far as hesitation goes. Dealer checked it said it was a bad fuel pump. Since they replaced it never had that issue again.

May want that checked out.

Should always get a carfax report to lore or less give you a idea what was done. I know it won't be 100% accurate all the time but it helps at least. As far as warranty what they told you? To me sounds like a 3rd party warranty for sure since Mopar cut off is 48 months from first in service date or 48k miles.

Most definitely not a normal thing for a hemi. That's BS. I have a hemi and it was the fuel pump going bad as I stated above.

 

+1 fuel pump. Fuel pressure bleed-down is the test to do.

+1 This absolutely not normal for a Hemi. I'm getting pretty pissed about these "factory trained" folks spewing this BS.
I have an '07 and a '14 5.7L (both in GCs), and they never even think of doing this.

 

Thank you for the replies. Its not a mopar warranty. I didn't purchase an extended. Its a NY state law that the dealer gives a 60 day power-train warranty. This was also from a private dealer who was the one who gave me the bs story. I have the carfax. Im the third owner and the last owner only had the car less than a year.

Yeah, you guys are right. Its probably fuel related. So possibly if that's the issue it would explain the lack of power on the highway too. I'll be checking pressure and do a leak down test too. I'll have to see if this is worth fighting the dealer on. I had a very difficult time arguing with him already. If its the pump, I'll see about having a private mechanic change it out because it looks too involved to be doing in my driveway. It would have been nice if they put in an access panel for the pump. Wishful thinking though...

I was looking at the recall notices for my car and shows that the TIPM recall was completed. It looks as if theres an external relay for the pump that was added. Anyone know where this might be installed? I just want to see if its there and if so, test it. I have a dishonest cousin who works for ford as an a-tech. He's been known to throw recalled parts in the trash. What I mean is, he says that he changed them when he didnt. I know, its a terrible thing but it happens... Better to verify.

 

When you first try to start it, try first pushing the start button and get the Durango into ACC mode, wait 5 sec then try to start it. This should get the fuel pump alittle head start on its job.

 

Oh so that might prime it? yeah I will try that tomorrow and see if it helps it along. Should be a good indication if it does.

 

So I went out today to check the fuel pressure and saw no shrader valve to hook up on, so I decided to shut the hood and call the dealer out of frustration. I'll bet theres a special tool needed or adapter to the rail and im currently at my wits end with this car. They finally agreed after an argument to have their mechanic at the shop across the street run diagnostics on the car tomorrow morning. I'll have to watch the mechanic when he checks pressure to see what psi its at. Am I correct to think that it should be around 58psi give or take a few? Whats a reasonable amount of time needed to do a leak down test? Should it exceed 45 minutes if there's no noticeable drop?
Thank you for all of the help!

 

oh yeah, forgot about the TIPM. People have reported the add-on relay failing.

discussion over here: https://www.dodgedurango.net/forums...-recalls-tsbs-2011/17439-tipm-fuel-pump-relay-recall-post524001.html#post524001

 

Thank you for that link, I will be sure to look for it before I leave this morning and then point it out to the mechanic. Im sure it could be easy to miss if you were not specifically looking for it. I suppose its possible that the relay could be defective where its not making full contact.. Its a very reasonable possibility and worth a look.

 

I know this is vague, Does anyone recognize this bolt to be a part off of the upper half of my engine?
Long story short, I got the car back from the dealers mechanic and I found this bolt along with rolled paper towels in the engine compartment. They were messing with the fuel delivery and possibly other things up top. The dealers mechanic wont return my calls to at least let me know.
Thanks

 

Looks like a intake manifold bolt


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-Mikey,

First and foremost, I feel for your situation. Here is what I recommend, and its worth what you have paid for it….

Figure out what your time is worth; headaches, troubleshooting and arguing with the person who sold you the car.

Once that is quantified, I believe you will just concede and run your car to a Dodge Dealership. Have them figure out what is wrong with your car and provide you an estimate for repair. (If my memory serves me, your car was just recalled because of the cruise control issue, so you have to go anyways.) At that point, you can take that estimate to either the first dealership and get some assistance $ to fix your D. If they don’t assist you, then you can go to the State for assistance.

Also, unless you are a certified mechanic, I would stop performing repairs by myself. I would hate for the dealership to say you “helped” in causing this problem.

Long story short- Pay the $$ have Dodge tell you what’s wrong, and then figure out how to fight from there.

good luck......

 

I really appreciate that and I completely agree. I actually made an appointment for Dodge next week because of the brake booster recall and then obviously while im there, have them do diagnostics (the cruise recall I didnt know about). Unfortunately in order for me to get any kind of state assistance or before getting another mechanic involved, I first had to give the dealer the opportunity and benefit of the doubt to have them or their mechanic fix it. They obviously failed so next stop is Dodge where ill pay and then try to re-coup the cost from the dealer.

 

This thread should help...old and long read but helpful info.

TIPM/Fuel Pump Relay recall https://www.dodgedurango.net/forums/showthread.php?t=17439

 

Just got the car back today. Its been at dodge for the past 4 days. They acknowledge that the car is not starting correctly but cannot find anything wrong. They were although quite happy to give me a substantial bill for their time (which i suppose I cant argue). Its actually a slight misfire at start, fuel pressure is fine. I might have to trade the car in and take a loss. It gets horrible gas mileage, maybe 10.5 at best and I checked it 3 times. My 12,000lb work truck is getting better mpgs. I got caught up in traffic last week with a 1/4 tank and after sitting 40 minutes, I was on E and thought I would run out of gas and be stranded.
My much heavier expedition with much less hp seems much faster than this 360 hp slug. At a loss here.. Only thing left to do is start changing parts blindly which never seems to work out..

 

Wow, crazy story....wonder if a good tuner could sort it out with a custom tune???
I has to be running very rich.

 

Mikey really sorry to hear about your issues with the car. Wish you never had any issues.

If the dealer says slight misfire what can be done to fix the issue then?

 

Wonder if you have a lifter starting to fail?

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They're willing to do further diagnostics however its getting very expensive and im not willing to pay them to start tearing apart the motor.

I actually ordered a diablo tuner when I first purchased the car but have not used it yet due to the issues.

 

Clogged injectors? If you pull them yourself and take to a shop, they'll clean and verify function for $100 or $200. Common procedure.

Have you pulled spark plug wires and Ohmed them? Any frays or kinks in the wires?

You're right; fuel pressure should be about 58 psi. To check, they would have tapped into the line feeding the fuel rails at the back of the engine compartment; I'd guess that's what the paper towels and bolt were for (bolt may have been used to temporarily plug a hose).

 

Btw, I think cleaning throttle bodies needs more care than some people use.

Some have Moly coatings that are destroyed with brake cleaner and whatever else people spray on to clean it. If you think you have a mysterious problem now, a mishandled TB will reset your perspective

 

Hemi doesn't have spark plug wires, unless you mean the harness going to the coil packs

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I'm not sure what I was thinking. It's been a long time since I played under the hood

 

Leaking fuel injector(s)? Would create the slow start as fuel that had built up will have flooded the engine, and can kill mpg as fuel is wasted.

 

I took it into a new private mechanic for a 3rd opinion today. He noticed the starting and drivability problems right off. They hooked it up to their system and said that the ecm is constantly losing communications. What might happen now? replace it or possibly re-flash the ecm? I have to take it back to the dealership however every dealer in the area is booked for at least 3 weeks. It was at the dealer a few weeks ago and not sure why they did not see that. The fun never ends..

 

I managed to get it to a different dodge dealer and they said that the pressure is bleeding off after an extended time and that the primary fuel pump must be replaced. $885 plus tax. Does that seem like the going rate? They didn't see anything computer related like the last mechanic had stated.

 

$885 sounds about right. I paid $1,100 to have mine done, but that’s including a tow ($125), a fuel system and induction cleaning service (75-100) as well. Friggin pump was like $450 by itself


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Thanks, I thought it seemed okay but figured I would ask. So it doesn't seem to make sense to shop it around at that price plus It sounds like they change these 'disposable pumps' all the time. Shop manager said "we have plenty in stock" and that he had 3 Cherokees in for the same problem. A fuel pump failing at 60K is embarrassing for Chrysler. Sure I understand that the previous owner is your worst enemy but it seems as if this is more of a common occurrence. I wonder if the 2018's are using the same pumps. Hopefully the replacements are beefed up a bit with a redesign.

 

I am betting all of the fuel problems are coming from being abused by their original owners (because, they are gonna trade it anyway). I purchased my 13 D a few years ago with 40k on it and after I started running 92 octane it started showing its true colors. I bet the first 40,000 miles on mine just ran 87 oct luckily I only have an issue with the damn thing not starting up all the time. if I let it sit in “run” until the fuel pump shuts off it fires right up. I would put money that my fuel pump is causing the problem. I hope your issue is fixed! I got mine from Syracuse NY and it has been super reliable. Towed an ol Buick from NY to TX to WA with no issues at all.