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Engine rattle....bad high/low lift rocker or cam lobes...or what?

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Discussion starter · #41 ·
Vice-White said:
Those pistons are the epitome of piston slap.
That engine was wrecked due to little to no maintenance. Did you see the sludge? You could use the shitiest oil in the world and change it every 3-5k and you would never get that. I think this person went by the oil life meter and the another few months later got an oil change.
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Yeah I also wonder if it was overheated? I know earlier year wrangles were plagued with high engine coolant temps. Just comparing what the top end looked like on my high mileage 2017 you can tell that engine was neglected...my 2017 top end is pretty darn clean for almost 100k miles. I wish the cam would already be here so I can finally finish this while the temps are in the 60s here.

BTW on a side note, I did not know there was also a camshaft holder tool to lock the cams into position (apparently used when swapping out phasers). Overkill if you ask me. I have seen folks swap out cams with just the plastic cam phaser lockers, which I found aftermarket phaser lockers made of aluminum. I am surprised no one has made a cad model of them so it can be 3D printed.
Image
 
Discussion starter · #42 ·
Speaking of tools here are the mopar part numbers for cam related tools (can be found cheaper via internet search and sometimes offered as a complete kit). Posting up as reference for others.

Camshaft holder (steel)

Phase locker (nylon)

Timing chain guide holders (aluminum)
 
Discussion starter · #44 ·
Arg! Took it apart again...dam gasket on the valve cover rolled and I was leaking oil all over the place. I swear that right side is just a PITA. Took everything apart as I did before but forgot to loosen the bolt holding this engine harness at the back (red circle in image). I only back it out maybe a 1/4 of an inch. FSM does not say to do this but I do not see any other way to give more room for the valve cover to clear the PCV tube in the back. This time I am putting some small dabs of silicone in the gasket groove to help hold it in place. Once it rolls good luck getting it back on without removing the cover.

Image
 
#45 ·
Duh-rango said:
Arg! Took it apart again...dam gasket on the valve cover rolled and I was leaking oil all over the place. I swear that right side is just a PITA. Took everything apart as I did before but forgot to loosen the bolt holding this engine harness at the back (red circle in image). I only back it out maybe a 1/4 of an inch. FSM does not say to do this but I do not see any other way to give more room for the valve cover to clear the PCV tube in the back. This time I am putting some small dabs of silicone in the gasket groove to help hold it in place. Once it rolls good luck getting it back on without removing the cover.

View attachment 127407
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Sometimes during reassembly just a little smear of silicon on gaskets grooves has helped me.
 
Discussion starter · #46 · (Edited)
Yup, the dabs of silicon definitely did the trick. No more spewing of oil from the valve cover. Man, I can remove the right side valve cover in my sleep. I will say the left side valve cover and cam swaps would be way easier as you don't have to futs with the upper intake manifold and EGR.
 
Discussion starter · #47 · (Edited)
Found this PDF on the CT forum which talks about the upgraded pentastar engine and ESS which some of the info I have never seen before, like the PCR and how the batteries operate.

Image


Also explains why the VVT phase locker used on pre-2016s will not work and why the cam locking tool I showed before is needed.

Image


Or how the IBS does not like to be bypassed which one needs to be careful how they wire up accessories so as not to bypass the IBS.

Image





 

Attachments

Discussion starter · #49 ·
I also learned the intake rockers are call Roller Finger Followers (RFF) and that the timing chain links are smaller/thinner. The twist on PCV I learned about the hard way last year as the Napa parts guy gave me a bolt on one which I had to return and show him the twist on one, he was like WTH?

Pretty nice little PDF eh?
 
#51 ·
Duh-rango said:
So apparently the +2016 pentastars run a higher energy ignition coil...wonder if the folks that do the PUG lower intake mod if they looked into running +2016 coils (assuming they bolt on)?
View attachment 127464

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The Gen 1 & 2 Pentastar COP's (ignition coils) have a 2-wire primary connector. The Gen 3 Pentastar COP's have a 3-wire primary connector. These two COP's are NOT interchangeable. Also remember that the Gen 1 & 2 Pentastar coils were used on flex fuel applications, which mean they have to have approximate 30-35% more energy than "normal" to light off a E85 mixture at cold start, so they are no slouches as far a energy output is concerned, especially if you are running pump gas.
 
Discussion starter · #52 · (Edited)
Ah ok, I did not even think to look up connection compatibility, instead of assuming it was compatible across the pentastar lineup like the hemis. The 6.2 SRT Hellcat/Demon engine used the same coils as the 5.7/6.4 only difference was the spark dwell was increased in the tune. Would have thought the Demon engines would have used a high output coil since it was designed to run on E85 as well?

2015 coil connector
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2016 coil connector
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#53 ·
They have made several revisions to the twin plug Hemi coil over the years, I think the progression was: 56029129AA through 56029129AF, then 68060346AA and now 68238603AA. I also know that some of the better HP aftermarket versions of that twin plug Hemi coils truly put out a lot more energy than the early factory units. But I have not seen an recent testing against the latest factory coil. Plus those factory coils are also found on the 1000hp Hellephant crate motors and the 1300hp Challenger DragPak engines.
 
#54 ·
Duh-rango said:
Evap is pretty noisy on the 3.6...although so is the one on the 5.7.

3.6 Pentastar


Supercharged RT
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Duh-rango said:
Evap is pretty noisy on the 3.6...although so is the one on the 5.7.

3.6 Pentastar


Supercharged RT
Click to expand...
Hi, my 5.7 hemi on 2015 citadel is having the same noise now. Troubleshooting from the workshop saying that the purge valve faulty and I’m still waiting for the part. Hopefully it’s not the ‘hemi tick’ or lifters.
 
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