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04 AWD Durango with 5.7, pulling engine to repair apparent bent connecting rod

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Motox115

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Here we go, another casualty of the dreaded hydro lock issue on an 04 with 5.7. Found water in cylinders #5 and #7. Removed heads and no trouble with valve seats, but piston in #5 does not come quite all the way to top of cylinder and appears to be some binding when that piston is transitioning from downward stroke to upward stroke - soooo I am assuming the rod is bent. Have heads off, exhaust manifolds off and most of the accessories off the front of engine. Getting ready to pull motor this weekend.

Few questions. It is AWD, do I need to drop the front differential/axel assembly to get the motor out? Any other "gotcha's" I should watch out for?

Luckily I noticed the problem just after starting in the driveway, was fairly noisy and running a bit rough. Shut it off pretty quickly and just started a couple more times briefly to confirm issue. So I don't think damage is to extensive, will know more once pan comes off.

I'm hoping I will be able to just replace the Piston, rod, and perhaps bearing for cylinder #5. Has anybody else had luck with just replacing these components if everything else looks good? I am planning to have the heads done due to the known issue of potential dropping of valve seats, don't want to risk that after going through all this work.

Also considering replacing engine/heads with rebuilt unit. Anybody have any suggestions as to suppliers? Any particular suppliers of rebuilt long blocks that should be avoided if I go that route?

Any other wisdom that can be shared out there??

Thanks in advance for any assistance
 
#2 ·
You won't need to do anything to the driveline other than pull the engine You may have collateral damage to the adjacent rod but only tear down will tell. Jasper rebuilds seem to have a good history and warranty if you decide to go that route.
 
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#3 ·
"I'm hoping I will be able to just replace the Piston, rod, and perhaps bearing for cylinder #5."

As far as rod and piston that should be fine, but why not replace all the rod and main bearings while the engine is apart? They can be found for relatively cheap and at that point 95% of the labor involved is done. No need to pull the cam, but replacing all other seals, bearings, and rings can be done for very little more $ or time. Timing chain kit and water pump in my opinion make sense to do while your in there as well. Maybe even oil pump. Change all 16 plugs while the engine is out as well. And personally I would replace the intake manifold as I believe that is the real cause of the hydrolock issues. Along with the front end redesign the intake was also changed on the newer years that did not have the hydro lock issue. Your call, but a slightly larger investment now could have the engine like new.
 
Discussion starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the insight gents.. Engine is out and bent rod on #5 confirmed. One of the most difficult parts was getting that Inspection plate off to gain access to the bolts connecting the torque converter, @!?XX. Definitely replacing the intake!!

The engine only has 100K on it, but understand your point about the bearings/seals JCC. May go ahead and do that, as you state I'm already in it that deep...

Thinking I need to do OEM Poston/rings/rod since I'm only doing the one. Where is the best place for genuine Mopar parts on the net with best price/service?

No indication of anything broken or hitting anywhere so wondering what source of noise was when problem occurred. Suspecting it may have been the rod slapping back and forth at the piston pin since the bent rod likely caused that motion to not be as smooth as normal??
 
#5 ·
Motox:
What is the build date on your D? They had a bad batch of valve springs in the early Hemi engines for the Durangos. My D was built 01/04, and dropped a valve at 39K.
Unless you can confirm that your oem springs are the upgrade/updated ones, you may want to replace those also since the heads will be off.
One less thing to worry about.

Don
 
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Discussion starter · #7 ·
This has been a great vehicle until this problem happened, wife loves this it. I am the original owner, purchased from local dealer, not happy at all that Chrysler didn't warn folks that had these vehicles of pending catastrophic failure of their premier engine?? At the very least they could have strongly suggested that owners have heads and intake work done at owners cost to prevent this kind of thing.

Was seriously considering adding a new hemi charger (perhaps Scat Pack edition) to my collection. Don't think I'll be going down that path.. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me...
 
#8 ·
The piston and rod can be very expensive. I actually purchased a replacement on ebay for the Durango I bought that had previously snapped a rod. Rod and piston still assembled cost me $30 and with new rings on it was really no different then brand new other then a bit dirty. If you are not going to replace all the rings I would not worry to much about matching the new rings to OEM. New OEM are unlikely to be the same as the 04 OEM, and even if they are brand new rings will not be the same as rings with 100k on them so you will have differences regardless. You will never notice the slight compression difference from one cylinder to the next. I know the engine I rebuilt at 160k had a couple stuck rings and decent amount of carbon build up. Cleaning the ring grooves was badly needed in my case to make sure the new rings could move freely. Make sure none of the rings have rotated lining up the gaps as well.

If your going to spend $800 on just the heads sounds like your all in on doing this right. So I would definitely do all the other maintenance items while your at it (water pump, timing kit, oil pump, all seals, ect.) I purchased everything from amazon or ebaymotors with exception of new intake from rockauto and was all in for about $1,200-1,500. You are jumping $800 ahead right off the bat with the heads. I just cleaned mine, lapped the valves, and replaced valve seals. Think a set of springs would of ran another $60, but I figured 160k in with no issues I must not have had the bad springs so I left them.

That inspection plate is a nightmare. From what I remember going back on was easier.
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
Ok, parts have arrived and starting to put it back together. Installation of the pistons is giving me fits, I've tried two different ring compressors and still getting hung up due to rings popping out not allowing full insertion of piston. I am using standard mopar pistons purchased as a complete set (piston, rod, bearings, rings) part #5302 1538 AD-001. These should be standard size pistons. The cylinders are original bore. I have tried a lisle brand adjustable ring compressor and the standard adjustable sleeve type to no avail, afraid i'm going to end up with a broken ring or worse if I keep attempting this. I've tried the pradual tapping approach as well as giving it a good blow to drive it in with one motion - always gets hung up on a ring - got as far as the last (top) ring once. Thinking I should try a fixed diameter tapered ring compressor, anybody have a specific tool p/n or diameter I should purchase? Any other ring compressors that work well for this application? I'm obviously stuck until I get this pistons installed. Was really hoping the get the block back in this weekend, guess we'll try again next weekend, aargh..
 
Discussion starter · #10 ·
Went ahead and purchased a fixed diameter Wisco ring compressor off Summit, 3.917 diameter (should be same as factory bore.) Hoping this solves my piston install issue. Gotta get this thing back together and on the road...
 
#11 ·
Did you check the ring end-gap prior to trying to install the piston? If too small rings can bind on warm up or install and score the cylinder.
 
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Discussion starter · #12 ·
I pulled the top ring off the piston and inserted to verify and gap is about .013". According to spec this should be correct, did not pull off all the rings to check. The pistons came with rings already installed. Original ring had a bit larger gap but also had 100K on it.
 
#13 ·
Been awhile since I did it, but getting things back in did suck. Had a standard ring compression sleeve. Lined everything up, and gave it one hard knock. Was no just sliding things into place. If the sudden hard knock failed would have to reset everything and try again. Was worried that might damage the new rings doing this method, but it ended up working just fine. After you get a few in you will have it down for the rest.
 
Discussion starter · #14 ·
Question, just want to confirm that the valve seat issue folks were experiencing was only with the intake valves. Dropped my heads off to have them redone and had a good conversation with them. He was fairly certain that only the intake seats should be replaced, hadn't seen issues with dropped exhaust seats. Plan is to replace all the springs and seals as well and resurface. Can anybody confirm the dropped seats was only on the intakes? Hoping to make some headway this weekend and have engine back in ready for head install when they are complete (bout a week).
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
WOW, what a difference the right tool makes!! Used the fixed diameter tapered ring compressor to insert piston, went right in with no problem. I started by placing the tool over the cylinder and making certain it was perfectly centered and then drew a line around it with a pencil. Inserted the oiled up piston/rings in the tool and made sure everything was straight inserted into cylinder making sure it was aligned correctly w pencil marks, a few taps with the handle of my plastic hammer and she slid right in..
 
Discussion starter · #17 ·
Good news, got everything put back together and fired her up yesterday. Everything good so far. Had a bit of what sounded like lifter noise near #6 and #8 but went away after a bit and has not come back, I expect it just took a bit of time for adequate oil to get circulated to that part of the engine. Did have a fresh oil pump (primed it best I could before installing it). BTW , I had the cylinders incorrectly identified at the beginning of this post. Cylinder with bent rod was #6, and both #6 and # 8 had water in them when I was diagnosing prior to head removal.

Bottom Line: Appx $2000.00 in parts and head work, lot of labor hours. Feel I made the right decision to fix it as it only has 105K and been a really good vehicle up till the hydro lock issue. Still looks good to, no rust and has been taken care of pretty well.

Replaced piston/rings/connecting rod/bearings in cylinders #6 and #8
Replaced oil pump
Replaced timing chain, gears, tensioner ( original tensioner broke very easily as I was compressing to remove the chain)
Replaced oil p/u tube, pan gasket, head gaskets, valve cover gaskets, exhaust gaskets, egr gaskets
Replaced intake manifold
Replaced water pump
Had cylinder heads done (new intake seats, new springs, new seals, resurfaced) $780.00
New head bolts, new exhaust manifold bolts, new crank bolt
All new spark plugs
fresh Mopar anti-freeze
Royal Purple break in oil
New radiator hoses
Cleaned everything up real good while apart
Ordered majority of parts from moparparts.net and rockauto, few items from summit.
Four New bolts/nuts to connect exhaust pipes to manifolds from local dealer - $57.00 (ouch! - sure glad I didn't pay them to do the work, can only imagine what it would have cost)
Cylinder walls looked really good, opted not to hone them as I would of had to remove everything from the block in order to clean properly afterwards.

Think that about sums it up, hoping for at least a couple hundred thousand trouble free miles :)
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
Additional notes:
The pistons I ordered came as a complete set - with rings installed, connecting rod attached and bearings. For standard bore, p/n 53021538AD $86.25 each mymoparpart.com

Also - added the new design cowl today with a bead of silicon under the rubber seal where it meets the windshield p/n 55362453AK, local dealer $140.00 As much fun as this "little" job was, not in any hurry to do it again ;)
 
#19 ·
Motox115 said:
Additional notes:
The pistons I ordered came as a complete set - with rings installed, connecting rod attached and bearings. For standard bore, p/n 53021538AD $86.25 each mymoparpart.com
Click to expand...
Did you catch that those are only for cylinders 2,4,6, and 8? Would be another part number for 1,3,5, and 7 or you would need to press out the pin and reverse the rod.

While if you did use the same setup for every cylinder unlikely to ever notice an issue you would actually have pistons that traveled just slightly higher in the cylinder on the side of the engine that they were incorrect. Some say best to swap them all if your building for performance as it increases compression, but I assume there is more downside then upside or they would not be made that way. Think increased blow by is most likely issue that would arise. So if you end up with oil in your air filter or random oil leaks anywhere else could be the extra blow by pressure in your crank case pushing oil out.
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
Correct, forgot to mention that. That part # is specific to the Right (passenger side) which is 2, 4, 6, 8. In this instance I replaced #6 (one w bent rod) and #8 (as I saw some evidence of water in this cylinder as well). There would be a different p/n for Left (drivers side).
 
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Motox115
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