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Hi all, new member and DD owner.

This thread kept me up so many nights... Good stuff - thanks to Bryali for being a pioneer! I blame him for the new blackhole in my bank account!

I bought a 16 DD RT back in June of 16 because of this thread, with the intention of slapping a whipple on it. I was looking at SRT Jeeps, but I needed more people hauling capacity (kids), so DD it was. a DD plus a whipple is still less than an SRT jeep... grant it, it's not 100% built for the power (brakes, engine bottom end, etc). In any event I've never had a stock vehicle in my life - tinkering is a hobby for me...which sometimes gets expensive...

The car was solid stock, but dare I say that it sounded meaner than it really was - still very respectable and enough performance to put a grin on a guys face while still being able to haul the child-army around town...

After wife-sponsorship was obtained I took my truck in to LMT in Waukesha Wisconsin and they did the install for me. I'm a car guy and amateur mechanic, which is to say I have the right tools and guts to get things done right and have modified (for better or for worse) every vehicle I've owned. I haven't had a naturally aspirated car since 1997...That being said, Whipple does not have a canned tune for the 2016's yet, so I still needed a custom tune. So I figured I'd take a back seat on this one and let the pros get their hands dirty.

Anyways, they dyno tuned it and I just got it back - so I thought I would contribute to this great collection of information...

My truck "stock" (I put a mopar CAI on it) came in at 293whp when they baselined it. They ripped all of that off and installed the whipple and tuned it for 93oct fuel and pulled an astonishing 505whp out of it. No other mods. +212whp gain from one bolt on - that's pretty unreal.

The tune was custom, but started with an HP Tuners baseline.

No Transmission tune seems to exist yet - which seems like a must have at this power level. I am positively hitting the torque limiter at WOT and it's backing the ECU down, causing some stuttering and wavy power. For now I just keep it under 65% throttle input. The smiles still happen and the truck MOVES. I'm sure I'll make a run down to Great Lakes this spring and get some 1/4 mile numbers. Until then, I'm just really enjoying the added low end torque and the feeling of effortless acceleration.


Below is a link to the library with dyno numbers...

http://www.dodgedurango.net/forums/members/transplant-albums-2016-dd-rt.html

View attachment 48233

Hi Transplant and Bryali, at how much PSI have you reached this horsepower ?
what is the safe/max PSI a 5.7 hemi can handle ?
Can i use racing fuel ? boostane ?
Where can i find replacement SC oil ?
currently in struggle installing a RIPP kit just wanted to get more info
 
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Hi Transplant and Bryali, at how much PSI have you reached this horsepower ?
what is the safe/max PSI a 5.7 hemi can handle ?
Can i use racing fuel ? boostane ?
Where can i find replacement SC oil ?
currently in struggle installing a RIPP kit just wanted to get more info
Hey man!

What year is your DD?

Incoming book...that'll teach you to ask!

7lbs seems to be the suggested max-safe limit. It's where I am at today. The tune is probably the most critical piece to stay safe. The general consensus I've read, based on who's blown up the 5.7's and who hasn't (no DDs I've read about, mostly chargers and challengers) is that the stock bottom end can handle a max of around 500hp at the wheels and that's pushing it. Lots are saying stay around 450. AWD vs RWD also makes a big difference back at the crank. At my level I'm probably a little on the naughty side, but the tune is very smooth and I only go all in on the throttle when I must dust a SRT8 Jeep or The new twin turbo Raptor that's driving around my area. :). Otherwise I try to be an adult.

Short story: no one has verbally blown an engine at 500 or less, yet. It also comes down to how you drive. I have 505WHP, but I don't tap into it at every stop sign.

505 fees really strong in this truck, but in the back of my head I'm not counting on the engine lasting to 200k. I'll probably drive it as is too 50k and then rebuild forged. I also invest in oil labs at each change, to look for signs of metal, coolant or fuel in the oil and make sure I don't see any past levels rising sharply.

Both Bry and I have Whipple's which are vastly different than the Ripp in terms of how they build boost. You're probably safer with the Ripp to be honest since it builds boost more slowly following RPMs, reach max boost near max rpm. The whipple hits max boost at like 2200 RPM and it's kind of aggressive. I've only floored my truck once from a stand still and all four tires spun enough to leave 10ft long black marks...that can't be good for the trans nor drive train, so I just don't do that...maybe once or twice more when I'm at the drag strip this spring to see where things end up. I have a gtech pro, but I don't believe it...we shall see come warmer weather.

SC oil - that question is probably best left to the SC mfg. I know Whipple is very specific on their oil. I'd just call them up. They probably have an oil change kit which may be slightly over priced, but once you get it you may be able to figure out what it is. Or they might straight up tell you what to use.

You can tune to whatever octane you like but you generally need to stick to it once you tune to it. That will require a custom tune and a dyno. You really don't want to experience detonation while under boost. The stock pistons won't take much abuse. I tuned to 93, as it's the norm in my region and stick to only a few stations I feel good about (in terms of fuel quality) I also keep some bottles of Torco octane boost with me if I have to fill someplace shady to boost a few points just in case. Better to run higher octane than needed to avoid detonation. Lower octane can pre detonate at higher cylinder pressures and temperatures, before the piston reaches the top of the stroke, and you might get a few of those in without catastrophic failure but eventually that will result in a broken piston, rod or crank. Really ruins your day.

In terms of booster, generally speaking if it comes in a plastic bottle it's not real octane boost. It's a lame treatment. The concentrated racing gases are required to be sold in metal bottles. Torco's boost is 118 octane race gas, and can raise pump gas up to 105 in the right qty, but it's expensive if you use it all of the time.

In any event I'd suggest you tune to what fuel is regularly available in your region.

E85 is another route to consider if it's widely available by you. E85, due to its higher alcohol content burns much cooler and essentially simulates 105 octane fuel. Obviously a custom tune by a shop that knows what they are doing is required, and you would have to run e85 permanently (unless drained and retuned). You can generally get much more power out of e85 at safer temperatures. I'm not an expert on e85 by any means - just repeating what smarter people have explained to me.

In any event, it's really all about the tune. If you are using a canned tune, you need to fall in line with its rules. More octane won't help without a matching tune, but it won't hurt either, other than your wallet. There are "safe" 500whp tunes and there are "not safe" 400whp tunes too. My biggest recommendation is find a shop that can tune and advise you. Preferably one that has some FI Hemi experience. My shop never tuned a Durango specifically before but they had done over a dozen whipple's in charger rt's and scar packs, etc. My base tune (starting point) was from HP Tuners.

I do promise to keep posting updates on my experiences if anything dramatic happens. Right now I have 2000 miles on my whipple, and the 8HP700 has learned nicely and now shifts perfectly. It did take like 30 days to fully get things worked out on its own. Hopefully I can simply enjoy my rig for a while before making any further investments!






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Hi Transplant and Bryali, at how much PSI have you reached this horsepower ?
what is the safe/max PSI a 5.7 hemi can handle ?
Can i use racing fuel ? boostane ?
Where can i find replacement SC oil ?
currently in struggle installing a RIPP kit just wanted to get more info
Figured I'd toss in my 2C....

With the Whipple (Stock) it's supposed to be at about 8.5 PSI. However, I don't believe you can compare that to your RIPP S/C. However, I did some additional mods to mine that had me pushing 550HP. With the addition of headers, straight pipe w/o cats, and methanol injection by alchy- that got me to the 550hp @ RWD. Pushing any higher is riding the fine line of your pistons failing and factoring in the trans too.

Your should reference your manual, or call RIPP, or search to see what the replacement Oil is, specifically. If you do it wrong, you could damage/void your SC and warranty.
 
Discussion starter · #224 ·
Hi Transplant and Bryali, at how much PSI have you reached this horsepower ?
what is the safe/max PSI a 5.7 hemi can handle ?
Can i use racing fuel ? boostane ?
Where can i find replacement SC oil ?
currently in struggle installing a RIPP kit just wanted to get more info
Transplant gave some very good responses so I'll just add or modify where I see something that can be added to the discussion. I will assume that you are in a 3rd Gen with an 8spd transmission for my answers:

First, the safe boost limit depends on so much more than just a number. A crappy tune will blow up at 2psi while a good tune may keep you safe out to 10 psi. However, the general rule seems to be right around 8psi. Whipple says their system out of the box is set up for a max of 8.5 and my gauge shows that I'm getting there at WOT just before the shifts. I will not be turning the boost up until my engine is forged (hopefully later this year or next). All Hemis (excluding the Hellcat) have notoriously thin top ring lands and soft pistons which don't handle high cylinder pressures very well. I also tend to drive it very responsibly around town. We use the extra power to get up to speed quickly and for towing but we don't drive around like every jackass in a Mustang revving their turd-box just for the sake of being a tool. We will be going to the track again just as soon as we find the time and I can convince my wife to drive.

You can use racing fuel but there's no way that's economical. Some VP fuels cost $10-$12/gal and up and you are not going to be able to reliably use it as a daily driver. Dumping some in the fuel tank CAN be done if you're willing to measure and all that but you run the risk of inconsistent ratios which may be bad if you get some bad pump gas and don't add enough 110 to compensate.. I'm not willing to do that so I use what is available at the pump. Speaking of E85 and pump availability, you CAN make significantly more power with E85 but you WILL lose some fuel efficiency and you WILL require an upgrade to your fuel system to keep up with the volume that E85 must flow to support our Hemis.. Anybody that says their OEM 3rd Gen Dodge Durango fuel system can support E85 flow demands either has a V6 that is rated for flex fuel or is probably full of crap.

Octane boosters are marketing gold. Everyone runs to their local auto parts store and buys a $5 bottle of "Magic Juice" and dumps it in their tank thinking they just made their car 1000% faster. Like I've said probably 1 million (muwhaaa) times, octane number only indicates resistance to detonation and does nothing to automatically make power. You have to tune the vehicle to add timing, increasing cylinder pressures, which yields more power. Second, those bottles of magic juice only raise octane POINTS and not NUMBERS, meaning 0.X value. So with that magic juice that raises octane "up to 7 points", your 20 gallons of 89 turn into 20 gallons and 1 pint of 89.7....AT BEST! Woohoo! Look at all that timing you can add with an increase of 0.7 octane.....sarcasm....moving on.... If you want a GOOD octane booster, look into TORCO but you'll see that most people only use it at the track and not as a daily driver additive because it is expensive and requires so much per use.

I know for a fact that Vortech has their own proprietary oil blend (see here at Amazon for example) so I would use that at whatever service interval they recommend. I can't be sure but I want to say it's in the 5,000-10,000 range so you can probably line it up with your vehicle's oil change.

Like Transplant said, the Ripp and Whipple make power very differently. I chose the Whipple because I like having max boost down low even if it means sacrificing some potential top end. I spend more time in the RPM range where the Whipple shines and less time where the centrifugal blowers shine.
 
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I've taken my G-tech pro to the track and it is surprisingly very accurate to actual time slips on time. On the MPH it showed me going much faster than the timeslips, but at most .1 sec off the time slip and often the same.
 
i'm getting a custom tune anyway since im installing Kooks as well. the tuner advised me to adjust the RIPP tune but i asked him not to touch it and only care to make my headers useful :D felt like he was trying to rob me. do you think i should go back to him and say "i'm sorry, do the right thing" :D

i think i understand what Bry is talking about when i had to change my old SRT pistons and crank shaft ( and engine heads before that ). thank you everyone for the great knowledge share. i also promise to keep updating if i experience anything in future with the Vortech.
 
I've taken my G-tech pro to the track and it is surprisingly very accurate to actual time slips on time. On the MPH it showed me going much faster than the timeslips, but at most .1 sec off the time slip and often the same.
I will see what the track says in a few months. G-tech put me at 0-60 of 3.8s and 1/4 of 12.08 @ 117mph. I've had an 11.6s sc Challenger before but it was RWD, so it was a less eventful launch but more top end pull. I don't know if I believe those numbers. I did 3 pulls and they were under 4s to 60 and 12.2-12.0 in the 1/4. I'm 6'5" and 325lbs. If that thing is accurate I bet my wife would get it into the 11's. That would be kind of cool... I had a Ford Lightning that ran 12.2, but that would make the DD the quickest truck I've owned. :)


2016 Dodge Durango RT - Whipple SC - Corsa Exhaust - 505AWHP
 
Discussion starter · #230 ·
Update: not related to the blower necessarily but race gas. I just priced a 5gal pail of VP NO2 for my Charger and it runs $85. That's roughly $17/gal. You're not filling up your 25gal fuel tank for $17/gal so just do what everyone else does and run whatever you can get at the pumps where you are
 
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Finally done :-? doesnt look so good

 
Discussion starter · #234 ·
Yes, the Whipple kit comes with a pin kit. Im pretty sure I included info in this write up about how I damaged my radiator while drilling the crankshaft....


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Good Lord you guys, so much awesomeness.

My wife wants me to wait until the warranty is up until I do major motor modifications... but my last name is Whipple so needless to say I have been wanting a Whipple Supercharger in one of my cars for a while (actually about 18 years, when I first heard about them) the 2018 RT is the perfect platform for it :)

this thread is making me antsy, I want 500 AWHP out of mine.
 
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